David Gewirtz, author of How to Save Jobs: Reinventing Business, Reinventing Work and Reawakening the American Dream, is a pragmatist and a realist. He recognizes that the vast majority of the 13 million or more illegal immigrants are settled and working in the U.S. Deporting them would damage the economy, disrupt many industries and serve as a major setback for the country.
Since most illeg� immigrants are acculturated to the U.S., how can we legally incorporate them into mainstream society? How, in fact, can these immigrants provide a boost to our economy rather than trigger controversy?
How to Save Jobs doesn't just focus on immigrants but covers a wide range of topics, such as suggesting ways to solve unemployment, exploring whether the Internet is causing jobs to flee the country and delving into why the health care crisis is creating a drain on the economy. Gewirtz functions as a policy thinker and provocateur and is trying to be many things to many people.
In discussing what can be done to solve the job drain, Gewirtz champions small business as the main way out of our economic doldrums. He says small businesses, not large corporations, can be at the forefront of creating the two million annual jobs that the country needs to stay competitive.
Gewirtz also wrote Where Have All the Emails Gone? which explores the dangers that lurk if White House e-mails are broken into. Previously, he wrote the The Flexible Enterprise, a timely book about how a company can survive the recession, written before the economic slowdown occurred.
Gewirtz is a multifaceted individual. Trained as a computer scientist, he serves as both executive director of the U.S. Strategic Perspective Institute, a think tank, and editor-in-chief of Zatz publishing, which publishes technical magazines such as Computing Unplugged and Outlook Power and computer books. He earned a B.S. in computer science from Worcester Polytechnic Institute in 1982 and now resides in Palm Bay, FIa.
In this question-and-answer session, Gewirtz discusses how changing immigration policies could boost the U.S. economy, how small businesses are the engine of job creation, and the dynamic role that immigrants could play in the U.S. if laws were changed.
The Hispanic Outlook: You noted that there are 13 million illegal immigrants in the U.S. today, equivalent to the combined populations of New York City and Los Angeles. You contend it is highly unlikely that all or most will be deported. Hence, what is the best way to solve the illegal immigrant issue?
David Gewirtz: Moving that number of human beings is an impossible task. Leaving such a huge percentage of people in legal limbo doesn't benefit any one. We need an alternative approach such as amnesty. Many immigrants pay rent and sales tax. If they all paid income tax, federal revenue would go up.
HO: How would legalizing them boost the American economy?
Gewirtz: We'd have one major problem off of our plate. Whenever there's an underclass, it brings down society. If they're afraid to get health care, they can easily become carriers of diseases. If they were legalized, we can increase disease control. You also have the potential to reduce law enforcement costs. In addition, we could increase revenue of federal, state and local income taxes. In fact, if you use income averages published by the Bureau of Labor Statistics, it could generate up to $50 billion in federa taxes.
HO: But isn't the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) cracking down on illegal immigrants, making raids on factories and trying to deport them?
Gewirtz: ICE is completely undermanned. They can make a dent, but they are not going to solve the problem. The best use of ICE would be to have them deport the most problematic illegal immigrants - lawbreakers, felons and members of organized crime.
HO: If illegal immigrants were deported, what effect would it have on the U.S. economy?
Gewirtz: You'd lose 13 million consumers. You'd have businesses that might not be able to replace certain workers.
HO: Despite the criticisms we read about illegal immigrants, what strengths do they bring to the economy?
Gewirtz: Most illegal immigrants are hard workers, often willing to do the work that many others don't want to. They're trying to make a living and create a Ufe like any other human being in America. They're pursuing the American Dream, and many would like to pay taxes and be part of the cycle of life.
HO: However, you write that we need to strengthen border security to reduce the half-million immigrants sneaking into the country annually. How should we best achieve that?
Gewirtz: We need to strengthen our security budget. That would help prevent illegal immigrants from entering and also lessen the possibilities of terrorism. Moreover, it would stop unscrupulous people from importing humans as cargo in coyote trains. These people torture other people and treat them as indentured servants. We need technology solutions, such as using seismic sensors to detect drilling for tunneling.
HO: If illegal immigrants are here to stay, how can we change our perception of them?
Gewirtz: The issue is twofold - some areas are suffering from a negative influx of immigrants. Folks in Southern Arizona are scared. When you wake up for breakfast and you see a person sitting on your porch who looks hungry and desperate, that can scare you. Some complaints are strident but real. For the rest of the country, we need to discuss how to integrate these immigrants into our society.
HO: Change is a two-way street. If legalized, what changes can we expect from immigrants?
Gewirtz: First of all, they'd have to pay taxes. They'd have to learn to become integrated into our society. Many people operating under the radar are used to operating that way. They'd have to change their mind set and become part of American society: abide by laws and not encourage others to immigrate into the country illegally. If we do accept them, it would be a one-time-only event. Their relatives would have to go through legal channels.
HO: What punishments, if any, should illegals face?
Gewirtz: Part of what they've been living through is a form of punishment. Perhaps they'd have to pay a fee or undergo public service, so technically there would be some form of punishment. Tracking it and making it happen would have to benefit America and not exceed the cost of administering it.
HO: You discuss how small businesses, more so than large corporations, will likely generate the two mulion jobs required to meet our labor needs. What role do immigrants play in these small businesses?
Gewirtz: In many cases, they're a key part of the labor pool. Individual entrepreneurs can go just so far before they need additional help to accomplish work. Despite the high unemployment, many small businesses have a hard time finding qualified technical employees.
HO: Immigrants are often drawn toward entrepreneurship. Why?
Gewirtz: Large corporations generally hire people who are mainstream, communicate in a certain way, and fit a certain mold, or generally you're not hired. What are the options for people who don't fit the mainstream mold? Many people who are creative, smart and industrious choose to be entrepreneurs. Entrepreneurship allows people to chart their own course, so they're not dependent on the permission of a gatekeeper to make a living. If you're an electrician and want to make a living and no one is hiring electricians, you knock on doors to see if people want their wiring fixed. You take control of your income.
HO: You write that ships have an Azipod thruster, which enables them to change directions quickly. Why does the country need an Azipod to help them navigate the issue of illegal immigrants?
Gewirtz: We're seeing the overreactions happening now. To many people, it's an intellectual problem, but not to the people who uve in Arizona and New Mexico. And to people living in the underclass, this is their daily existence. Some things take forever to change. We could be talking about illeg� immigrants until 2050 with no change of policy. As long as we think we can deport 13 million people, we can discuss this for the next 40 years. If politicians wanted to, we could enact legislation and change this situation overnight.
HO: One factor causing our recession and high unemployment stems from outsourcing. What can be done about it?
Gewirtz: We need to stop giving tax incentives to companies that outsource jobs. The United States government should stop spending taxpayer money on services provided by countries outside of U.S. We spent a lot of money buying data-processing services from India. We should cut that out and buy data-processing services made in the U.S.A.
HO: You note that the top 40 corporations in the world employed 18.6 million people, which are outnumbered by the 27.6 million small businesses. Why can small businesses produce more job growth than megacorporations?
Gewirtz: It takes a long time to create a mega corporation and takes a lot less time to produce a small business. Two or three people can start a business in a week. It took 20 years to produce Walmart. Apple has been around since the 1970s.
HO: H�spanles and African-Americans have been in the forefront of entrepreneurship. What could be done to help them?
Gewirtz: We need small business training in high school and community colleges. Community colleges, in particular, should train people to manage and run small businesses. We should teach them about cash flow, the nature of entrepreneurship, how to hire people and manage businesses. Community colleges could incubate new businesses. They have libraries and research facilities.
HO: You run the U.S. Strategic Perspective Institute? What does it focus on?
Gewirtz: It's a nonprofit, nonpartisan policy institute. It's a think tank, dedicated to looking at tough problems such as online safety, presidential technology, health care, jobs in America and how to determine what is America's share of any product. For example, iPhones are designed in the U.S. but made in China. How much of that money goes to the U.S? We're developing a database for every product online to tabulate how much of the amount goes to America and how much goes elsewhere.
HO: Returning to immigrants, given the whole controversy, what do you expect to happen in the next few years?
Gewirtz: Realistically, we could decide to reframe the discussion of immigrants on three separate topics: What do we do with immigrants in America in the future? How do we solve the legal issue? How do we solve the problem that border states are facing on day-to-day basis? That could lead to some solutions.
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